Preet Bharara:

From CAFE and the Vox Media Podcast Network, this is Stay Tuned In Brief, I’m Preet Bharara. Today, we’re going to discuss an often overlooked but growing kind of crime, wildlife trafficking. The demand for commodities like rhino horns and elephant ivory has led to sprawling trafficking rings that profit from the continued decimation of wildlife species. My guest this week, Andrea Crosta, is the Executive Director of Earth League International, an organization that has been called the CIA of wildlife trafficking. Earth League is an undercover investigations and intelligence agency that infiltrates and exposes the criminal networks at the center of the illegal wildlife trade. Andrea Crosta, welcome to the show.

Andrea Crosta:

Thank you very much. Thanks for having me.

Preet Bharara:

Could we start with your describing for listeners how this Earth League International came to be and what its mission is?

Andrea Crosta:

Yes. I was in Kenya in 2010, for my previous job. I was a security consultant for high profile individuals with a lot of security problem, let’s put it this way. And I was consulting the former Prime Minister of Somalia, who lived in Nairobi back then. In 2010, we were right in the middle of the elephant poaching crisis, when we were losing 40 even 50,000 elephants every year for the ivory trafficking. I was right in the middle of it. I went out with the rangers several times, and I witnessed those terrible scenes that you can probably imagine. Entire families of elephants destroyed, killed with AK-47, by poachers. And I started to… I talked to the rangers, and I could almost see the question marks on the head of the rangers. The whole world was asking them to solve this problem.

And environmental crime… So wildlife crime is part of environmental crime, is the fourth-largest criminal enterprise in the world, almost $260 billion per year. And I thought it was unfair to ask the rangers to solve it. It is like asking the local sheriff to solve a narco trafficking. It’s simply not right. So I started to ask around, “Okay, who is using professional intelligence to fight back? So who is using professional intelligence in the same way it is used to fight other global threats, like terrorism, or organized crime or narco trafficking?” And the answer was nobody, and I found it absurd. And that was the reason why big international traffickers behind this whole thing could work, operate undisturbed for decades. So I decided to drop my job, and to create one day, the first CIA for the planet.

Preet Bharara:

So I want to get into your techniques and methods in a moment. But before we do that, I just want to get a sense of the kinds of criminal activity or bad conduct that you target. We talked about elephant poaching, a second ago. What are the other kinds of things that you see that are terrible, that you’re trying to combat?

Andrea Crosta:

Yeah. First of all, we don’t operate at poaching levels. So we don’t go after the poachers. We go after exclusively the big international traffickers. Poachers or illegal fishermen, for example, are very often poor people living in the middle of nowhere, and try to make living. So you can imagine the temptation when in Africa, someone, a trafficker, offers you 3, 4, 5 years of salary to kill an animal, to kill an elephant, when you don’t have anything, and maybe you have a family of 10 waiting for you at home. Of course you do it.

So we go after only the big international traffickers. Who usually are part of sophisticated international. Transnational trafficking network, trafficking syndicates. And they have their hands in pretty much everything. So, they can traffic… At the same time, these are people that can traffic ivory, rhino horn, pangolins, tiger parts, timber, all kind of… Shark fins. Some of them are even into illegal mining. So it’s a variety of environmental crimes. Wildlife crime is part of it. And the interesting part is that these individuals are often into other serious crimes, and that is called environmental crime convergence. So while they are trafficking ivory or shark fin, they’re also into money laundering, human smuggling, narco trafficking. So we approach this project from a very unique point of view, and at the highest possible level.

Preet Bharara:

And how much support do you get from the US government and other governments around the world?

Andrea Crosta:

So we collaborate with the US government and other governments around the world. In the United States, we routinely share our confidential reports with at least four or five different agencies. By the way, two weeks ago, there was a big operation. US law enforcement arrested two of the most important wildlife traffickers ever arrested on US soil. It happened near San Diego, and we were part of this operation as well. Sometimes, we collaborate with governments, with other governments. In the past, we worked a lot with… We share information, we help the government of Bolivia, of Peru, of Mexico, Thailand, South Africa. We don’t get support from them. So, it’s important to understand that-

Preet Bharara:

You’re not funded by governments?

Andrea Crosta:

No. Sometimes, we can apply for grants, like everyone else. Sometimes you apply for grants sometimes, and then you might lose or win. They’re usually very complicated to put together. And we are a small organization, so it’s a big task for us to apply for a grant. Sometimes, we do it together with partners, but we don’t get money directly from them. So that’s an important thing to understand for our donors, that the money we get from private individuals, foundations and family offices, that money is used also to support the work of law enforcement agencies.

Preet Bharara:

You mentioned a big operation in the last few weeks, and there were two targets that were taken in?

Andrea Crosta:

Correct.

Preet Bharara:

What was their correct conduct? What are they alleged to have done?

Andrea Crosta:

So they’ve been trafficking seafood, shark fins, and totoaba for a long time. Totoaba is a fish endemic of Baja, California, Mexico. And they actually… It’s for the Chinese market, for the traditional Chinese medicine. They actually don’t want the whole fish. They just want the swim bladder, and it’s very expensive. The fishermen in Baja, California can get 3, $4,000 for one swim bladder. And the same swim bladder is then sold in China for 30, 40, even $50,000 a piece. We actually filmed in China one swim bladder at $100,000 a piece.

Preet Bharara:

Why is the demand that high, and why is the price so high for something like that?

Andrea Crosta:

Well, it’s complicated, but the demand is strong. And in this particular case, according to traditional Chinese medicine, the swim bladder of this particular fish is very helpful for your blood, and also for pregnant women. So there’s a very strong request, and it’s completely legal. And the problem of this particular fish is that the by-catch, the of this fish, the totoaba, is the vaquita. The vaquita is a small porpoise, also endemic of… A relative to the dolphin. Also endemic of Baja, California. And it was completely destroyed, because of the [inaudible 00:08:16]. And now, there are maybe less than 10 individuals. It’s the rarest mammal in the world, and completely wipe out, because of this illegal fish. So we have been trying to work on this problem for the past five, six years, and the persons arrested were deeply involved in this trafficking.

Preet Bharara:

Are there other animals or categories of animals that are most at risk because of human action?

Andrea Crosta:

Many. You all know, of course, iconic species like elephants. Even more, rhinos. Only maybe 20, 25,000 rhinos are left in Africa, most of them in South Africa. Tigers, think about tigers. 100 years ago, we had 100,000 tigers in the wild. And now, we have around 4,000. So we almost lost all the tigers in the wild, in 100 years. And in this particular case for the tigers, they… Again, in traditional Chinese medicine, they look mostly for the bones. So with the bones, they make wine, alcohol. And then, they also want the fangs, for superstitions. So, that’s an example. Another example is the pangolin, is one of the most trafficked mammals [inaudible 00:09:35] animals in the world. Again, they want the meat and the scales of the pangolin. We have been working a lot on jaguars, in South America. In that case as well, they want the fangs and the bones.

And of course, then there is… Apart from animal species, we have huge problem with deforestation. We also work on deforestation, the trafficking of timber, so illegal logging, and then the trafficking of timber. So there are a lot of gigantic problems. In general, I describe this whole thing as the criminal exploitation of nature. That’s what it is.

Preet Bharara:

Yeah. So I want to talk about what the legal regime is, and what laws exist. There’s something called the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora, which was propounded in 1973.

Andrea Crosta:

Correct.

Preet Bharara:

Can you explain what that is, and is that helpful or not?

Andrea Crosta:

It’s called CITES. Yes. This convention has been established to regulate the trade of any product from nature, basically. So not only animals, timber, but also not only endangered species, per se. So this convention for example, regulates also all the products for the fashion industry. For example, the skins of reptiles, for example. It regulates the trade of flowers, everything from nature. And the problem is that this convention, which is basically the only international tool that we have to try to stop trafficking, is a trade convention. The T of CITES stands for “trade.” Let’s not forget that. It’s a UN sort of convention. So, it works like every other convention. You’re probably more familiar with the COP for climate change. So there are COP also for CITES. And it takes forever to take decisions. You have all the parties, all the nations gathering, every now and then, and they make decision, voting. So, it takes forever.

And a great example is the vaquita, this little dolphin, the little porpoise I mentioned before. A few years ago, I would say 5, 6, 7 years ago, we still had 500, more or less, of these vaquitas in the Sea of Cortes. And this is when we started to really lobby CITES, “Hey, you have to do something. You have to pressure the government of Mexico to protect these animals. And you also have to do investigation on the international traffickers, and this and that.” And the only tool that CITES has is a ban. So they can ban other products, so it’s a significant commercial loss for the state. But we started five, six years ago, and only this year, actually these days, if you look at the news, these days, they are finally discussing a ban on Mexico. And it’s a bit too late, because the vaquita from 500 individuals got down to less than 10. So it’s on the brink of extinction, literally.

Preet Bharara:

So if you had the power, what would you do to that convention, to enhance it or replace it, both in the United States and around the world?

Andrea Crosta:

Yeah. Well, again, it’s a trade convention. So you cannot honestly ask for… They have a small law enforcement unit. But you cannot ask a trade convention, a trade… To all of a sudden start policing the world. Because also, they don’t have jurisdiction, they don’t have the power, they don’t have anything.

Preet Bharara:

So what do we need?

Andrea Crosta:

So my solution, what we are doing, is that in my opinion, based on my experience… I’ve been doing this for 12 years, but I’ve been in conservation for all my life. The only country at the moment able and willing to do something about it is the United States. And that’s why we made this decision some years ago to put a lot of effort in supporting the work of the US. We have a long arm. We can reach people also in other countries. We have a set of acts, laws, like the Lacey Act for example, that we can apply to big traffickers. Our focus on environmental crime convergence or the convergence of environmental crime with other serious crimes is also very useful, because it offers law enforcement agency different angles. They can use different laws.

To make an example, in the case of a big ivory trafficker or timber trafficker, if the laws, local laws or international laws are too weak, we can provide information that this person or this network is involved also in money laundering and human smuggling. And you can go after these people for that. I call it the reverse Al Capone approach. If you remember, Al Capone was taken down for tax evasion. And we are trying to do the opposite, actually. We are trying to help law enforcement to go after these people for crimes that are more serious than environmental crime or wildlife crime. So this is how we’re trying to change the game.

Preet Bharara:

Before we go, I want to go back and talk about your methods, and this label that you’ve been given, the CIA of wildlife trafficking. Can you explain, maybe by way of specific example, how an undercover operation might work, how you make sure that the people who are employed are safe? I know this is… I’ve dealt in law enforcement for much of my life. And usually, they were actually law enforcement agents who were going undercover, and it was quite dangerous. How do you address those issues?

Andrea Crosta:

Yes. So I call it the CIA for the planet because I got inspiration from the agency. And I also, when I decided to create this agency, because of my past, I was connected to agencies and people around the world. So I started recruiting former FBI and former CIA. My right-hand, Mark Davis, at 28 years with the FBI and the CIA. My left hand also in the agency. So we have that mindset, and we try to use… Within the limits, of course, we are a nonprofit private entity. Within our limits, we try to use the same methodologies, especially when we talk about so-called HUMANINT, or human intelligence. So the core of our activities is the recruitment of sources and informants around the world, or in the target countries. And these are people that can provide us… These are people that sort of gravitate around these networks, the criminal networks that we investigate, and they provide information, constantly.

Plus, we have a team of undercover operatives, about dozens of them, of different nationalities and different languages. And they are really [inaudible 00:16:15] with a lot of experience. Like our Chief Investigator has more than 25 years of experience in doing this. And they are really good in basically… I wouldn’t call it infiltration, but it’s a very sophisticated social engineering work. Meaning, if I can oversimplify even more, we are really good in becoming your friend. And then when we become your friend, when we are friends, you will tell us everything we need to know. And we need to know everything about you, if you’re a bad guy. Not just about your illegal activities, but we are also interested in your legal activities, because they very often overlap the two. We want to know how you move the money, if you are bribing somebody. So it’s a long, long-term intelligence operations, versus maybe short-term investigations. We prefer to put a lot of time, in order to really go as high as possible.

And then, we have a group of crime analysts, and their work is to process this incredible amount of data that our team bring back from the field. And we also do a lot of work and investigation on social media. For example, we use a few software. We can follow these people on social media, so we find… For example, we are able to identify new links, and how different entities and different targets are linked to each other. So it’s a very sophisticated work. And at the very end, there is always a confidential intelligence brief, which is our final product that we share with law enforcement.

Preet Bharara:

Final question. What are you most hopeful about in this work?

Andrea Crosta:

I’ve been putting a lot of time and effort, and I basically sacrificed my life to this. I think it’s happening. We are finally convincing law enforcement, governments and even the media to shift the attention from the poacher to the traffickers. If we were talking about narco trafficking, it’s important to go after the big narco traffickers, not the person who is selling dope here around the corner. That’s a waste of time. So it’s finally happened, after many years of… We also were in two big documentaries, so we do our part. We have a secret face, but we also have a public face. And it’s finally happening. People are… And crucial, key people and stakeholders are understanding finally that the focus should be big traffickers, transnational trafficking networks. And we see a lot of traction with law enforcement, especially in the US. Finally, big traffickers are getting arrested. So maybe, hopefully, something is finally changing.

Preet Bharara:

Andrea Crosta, thank you for being on the show, and thank you for your important work.

Andrea Crosta:

Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Preet Bharara:

For more analysis of legal and political issues making the headlines become a member of the CAFE Insider. Members get access to exclusive content, including the weekly podcast I co-host with former US Attorney, Joyce Vance. Head to cafe.com/insider to sign up for a trial. That’s cafe.com/insider.

If you like what we do, rate and review the show on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen. Every positive review helps new listeners find the show. Send me your questions about news, politics and justice. Tweet them to me @preetbharara, with the hashtag #AskPreet. Or you can call and leave me a message, at 669-247-7338. That’s 669-24-PREET. Or you can send an email to letters@cafe.com.

Stay Tuned is presented by CAFE and the Vox Media Podcast Network. The Executive Producer is Tamara Sepper. The Technical Director is David Tatasciore. The Senior Producer is Adam Waller. The Editorial Producers are Sam Ozer-Staton and Noa Azulai. The Audio Producer is Nat Wiener. And the CAFE team is Matthew Billy, David Kurlander, Jake Kaplan, Namita Shah, and Claudia Hernandez. Our music is by Andrew Dost. I’m your host, Preet Bharara. Stay tuned.